Protein Requirements for Lightweights

[Sandra C.]

Do lightweights need less protein because of their small size? After initial major losses, and size reduction, do the protein requirements change to a lower amount?

I was dropping lbs faster when I was having less protein than now- Nut asked for 80g- 120g protein, aim for 120g she said, at 4 months out. Now I am 5 months out, scale is stuck on the same weight with 120g protein. When I have less protein than 120g I drop a lb. right away. I'm 5'3" 168 lbs, goal 120 lbs.
( lost 80 lbs first 4 months, D.S.) My fluid 64oz.

What amount of protein do you lightweights use for best weight loss, and fluid?

[majormom]

Jan 10, 2012 11:10:52 GMT -5 Sandra C. said:

Do lightweights need less protein because of their small size? After initial major losses, and size reduction, do the protein requirements change to a lower amount?

I was dropping lbs faster when I was having less protein than now- Nut asked for 80g- 120g protein, aim for 120g she said, at 4 months out. Now I am 5 months out, scale is stuck on the same weight with 120g protein. When I have less protein than 120g I drop a lb. right away. I'm 5'3" 168 lbs, goal 120 lbs.
( lost 80 lbs first 4 months, D.S.) My fluid 64oz.

What amount of protein do you lightweights use for best weight loss, and fluid?

With a DS, 120 grams works for my labs. Not sure about maintaining a constant weight loss. I've always done somewhere between 100 and 120 in shakes alone and think of food as ~whatever~. My dietitian even tested my labs to see for herself that 90 was too little and 120 was just right.

[Sandra C.]

Thanks Major mom,
I'm not looking for constant weight loss, but downward trend is nice. I don't want my body to get comfortable at this weight now, I have 50 lbs to go. 120g protein is my nuts suggestion but she would go as low as 80g, and as high as 150g for me. On our vacation, I had over 120, lost 4 lbs in the week. Ate more real food and meat, with protein lemonade between meals.
Sandra

[majormom]

Jan 10, 2012 15:58:57 GMT -5 Sandra C. said:

Thanks Major mom,
I'm not looking for constant weight loss, but downward trend is nice. I don't want my body to get comfortable at this weight now, I have 50 lbs to go. 120g protein is my nuts suggestion but she would go as low as 80g, and as high as 150g for me. On our vacation, I had over 120, lost 4 lbs in the week. Ate more real food and meat, with protein lemonade between meals.
Sandra

How about your activity level since you're off vacation? I guess I'd go back to what worked while you were vacation, it sounds like a good plan.

[Ladytaz]

I was the opposite. The more protein I got in the faster I lost weight. I get in about 150 grams a day now. My last labs my protein was at the bottom of the range and I want it to be higher.
eta I also made sure I get in at least 100 oz of fluids a day. Most days it is closer to a gallon but that isn't a problem for me because I am always thirsty.

[ModestoK]

How long is your common channel?
Mine is 125, and if the average DSer @ 100 only absorbs 50% of their protein calories, I would absorb 62.5% or so if I've figured it out right. Guess I'll ask tomorrow.
So it is possible that you would need less protein than the average DS bear if you have a longer common channel.

That being said, you want to take into account your lean body mass. You might be losing 1# when you go below 120 grams of protein, but is that fat or muscle? You want to preserve all of the muscle you can because in the long run more muscle burns more calories and = greater fat loss. You might weigh more but will look smaller if you have muscle mass and less fat volumn on your body.
I personally have a high lean body mass, so I need more than 100 grams of protein. I aim for 150 or higher, just to be sure I absorb 100 grams after my DS does its magic, on the theory that we need .8 or more grams / pound lean body mass per day that is absorbed.
It is a balancing act, for sure.

[msbatt]

Your rate of loss will naturally slow as you get closer and closer to your goal. The amount of protein you actually need depends on your individual reaction to surgery, and ONLY your labs can really tell you how much is right for YOU.

[Sandra C.]

Hi guys,
Thanks for all your ideas. My common channel is 100.
Before vacation, with very slow weight loss, I was at the gym 2 1/2 hrs 5 days a week- 10 weight machines, floor stretches, mile on bike, walking a mile, and twice a week personal trainer. I have lots of muscle. I don't want to use it up if I don't eat enough protein.

On vacation I was laying around the pool for hours, walking the hotel grounds a lot, eating 3 small meals of meat, and 4 double protein lemonades a day. Protein totals were higher than at home, 150g. No carb foods then or at home. Limited to 50 carbs for fiber gummies, and choco calcium chews and ingredients of protein shakes. I did use Muscle Milk w/ caffeine only for the week, to help me drive 2 days there and 2 days back. I lost 4 lbs that week. More protein may be better for me too.

This week my exercise is limited due to an inflamed knee cap, injured falling off a ladder last year. Seeing an Orthopedic Sports Medicine doc tomorrow, to see if I can safely get back to working out.

Possibly the caffeine increased my metabolism? I'll give it another try. When I read caffeine affected calcium absorption, I stopped drinking it. My calcium levels and all the other tested things are very good, they told me today. It was a short list blood test from my PCP. Next month, the full out blood test from my surgeons office will tell more.

My fluid totals are usually 65-75, docs say its good.
I am carrying a "to go" cup everywhere, sipping protein fruit drinks all day, even at my doctor apts. I just visited the urologist with a diagnosis of bladder spasms from a liquid diet. I do drink more than I eat. They gave me "Vesicare " to calm it down. My system is not used to all the fluid I am pushing!!

I am afraid of the weight loss window closing soon. I am always asking the docs, and nut how to increase loss. They say to add protein, not over 150g, cut carbs, veggies are ok, no fruit. I wondered what other people have had success with, since many here have gone their own way with creative ideas for weight loss. ;-)

[grdngrl]

All this talk of fluids makes my already dry mouth thirsty!!! Struggling to drink enough water and protein - I know, it takes time and keep sipping!!!

Three weeks out and I miss just drinking a glass of water LOL

[Sandra C.]

Hi grdngrl,
I have a dry mouth all the time from meds. My doc- not D.S. doc, suggested using Biotene toothpaste, mouth wash and purse size mouth spray. The gum did nothing for me. The new tooth whiteners in paste and whitening rinses are causing mouth sores for me and my daughter. Chapstick Moisture helps. I also use a few SF hard candies each day, but they increase gas. Another dry mouth cause I found is calcium, in the shake mixes, and calcium chews. Citracal calcium citrate Petites pills are a good dry mouth solution. When I feel a craving for sweets, I use the berry, or carmel calcium chews, and Calcet citrate- Creamy bites Choco fudge, or lemon.

I am thinking my old lipstick may be transferring germs to my lips then into my mouth. Time to change my lipstick. Since my D.S. surgery little things like this seem to bother me more. The bottled water was tasting metallic, I wondered if the plastic chemicals were contributing to my dry mouth. I now carry filtered tap water in a "to go "cup, it helped. Lemonade flavored protein mixes seem to make my mouth water more, I sip them most of the day. The best one for me with least noticeable calcium is from Grand Health Partners store, may be the same packet fruit mixes as Bariatric Choice on line. There are" mouth watering"SF cough drops, they help, but don't taste as good as the SF hard candies. I like the SF peppermint swirl, SF lemon drop, and SF Nips carmel. Keep track of their carbs, they add up fast.

Be sure to have approved any changes to your diet or supplements by your doctor first. 3weeks out has specific dietary instructions. I am 4 1/2 months out. I can drink 3 normal sips in a row now without pain. Be patient, it just takes time to get back to normal !!!!
Sandra ;-)

[Sandra C.]

Hi ModestoK,
I was thinking about your observation about your having a longer common channel, and the protein needs. I would think more of everything would be absorbed. Having lots of protein never seems to be a major issue, but too many carbs is what to watch out for. I began to chart all the little carbs from supplements, shakes.... I was surprised to see I had been ingesting almost 50 carbs unknowingly. My limit is 50. None left for food!!! The next question is " Lightweights carb limits", bet they are lower than everyone else's.

Let us know what you find out from your appointment. I have a meeting tonight, going to ask about it.

[lauriv]

I'm close to your weight also. I'm 163. Had surgery on 9/1/2011 so our surgery dates are close. I've only lost 61 lbs. you mention your worried our weight loss window is closing soon. That has me worried! My weight loss has slowed way down! Yikes! I have forty pounds left to go. Have there been lightweights that don't get to goal?

[Sandra C.]

Hi Lauriv,
I'm not going to think about any window closing, but stay vigilant about keeping up with vitamins, fluid and protein, and lots of exercise. Thats all we can do. Think of a ball bouncing down the stairs, not rolling down a slide. there will be little plateaus all along the way, but overall our bodies are shrinking. Everyone says not to look at the numbers so much, but how your clothes fit.

At the monthly D.S. meeting with Dr. Kemmeter tonight, we talked about protein requirements, and common channel lengths. He said there are more variables for each individual that come into play. They look at it on a case by case basis to determine the protein needed. Some attendees are still losing at 2 years out. I believe weight loss will continue, but at a slower rate if carbs are under control, and fluid and protein levels are good. He went on to say after surgery, and weight loss, there may be unresolved issues which have contributed to the weight gain in the first place that need to be addressed or regain is possible. I think its worthwhile to talk to the psychologist trained in bariatrics to help me sort out how and why I came to need this surgery. Once we reach our goal weight learning to maintain at our ideal weight and stay healthy with enough vitamins will be a challenge too. The surgeons work is done, and ours is just beginning. I believe we can make it !!!

[Lee]

Jan 12, 2012 0:21:43 GMT -5 Sandra C. said:

Once we reach our goal.....The surgeons work is done, and ours is just beginning. I believe we can make it !!!

I love this last sentence. At two years out, I still need to track food to stay where I want to be. Vitamins can challenging. Exercise is daily and can be a chore at times.

My surgeon gave me a tool. It's up to me to decide what I want to do with it. At 61, I've never been in a situation of learning to maintain. Year three is definitely going to be interesting.

[Sandra C.]

Hi Lee,
I expect to be journaling food choices endlessly. It seems to help my doctors keep track of my eating, otherwise they think I am losing too fast to be healthy. I am 57, wondering about body lifts and the works....How did you chose your PS? I would travel for the best.

My surgeon also used the "Tool" word. He impressed on us all we had lots of work ahead of us. I was hoping the weight loss would be quicker than this. My husband thinks I am building muscle which is heavier than the fat I am losing. My new clothes are lose once again.

Maintaining will be a balancing act. I feel like it is going on now with very little loss showing up on the scale.

I like weight lifting as a 3-4 day a week exercise program, with a day off between lifting days. I don't work, but have lots to do preparing for a move to a new house in town next month. The weight training will be good preparation for moving day!!!

[Lee]

I read up on various plastic surgeons. Two people who live in my area had gone to Dr. Sauceda and really liked him. The thought of one surgery recovery instead of the four that Kaiser recommended was important to me. The price was great. Five nights in a clinic, then seven nights in a hotel with daily visits from my surgeon as wellas daily visits from his nurse. She washed my garments, put me in the shower. Put ointment and gauze back on. Removed sutures and drains. Two weeks of medical attention was perfect.

Good luck with your move!

[sheanie]

SandraC: I'm confuddled. Your siggy says your current weight is 127. Why do you say you are trying to lose more weight? Your siggy has <<<<GOAL>>>> in it, as well. Am I missing something?

I have always gotten in at least 90 grams of protein per day. Usually between 120-150. My weight dropped like a stone, but I never weighed. Don't own a scale. Only weighed at GHP. Only saw one NUT there, after a really bad experience with the other one. I'm 52, comparable to your 58. I don't exercise. At. All. With the exception of doing the stairs at work, and walking instead of riding whenever possible. I've been recently thinking about Zumba, but haven't been cleared for exercise after breast augmentation.

Whenever I feel my pants getting tighter, I start reading the labels on my foods again. I've found that periodically, the basterds have snuck more sugar in my favorite foods. Or they've increased the size of the Cheezit bags in the vending machines. That sort of sneaky, under-handed BS. And have you noticed that the sizes of the candy bars are getting bigger again? My Snickers bar, for example, has grown by 2 ounces, which I suspect is all chocolate, and no peanuts, naturally.

BTW, you have a Kemmeter sleeve. You're lucky. Mine is a Foote sleeve, which is too small and very tight. It's been hard getting it stretched out to a legitimate sleeve size.

[sheanie]

Oh, and I don't believe in the "weight loss window". Like I mentioned, when my pants get tighter, I just eat more bacon.

And your dry mouth could be from the artificial sweeteners. Many people are sensitive to those. In Michigan, I don't know why anyone buys bottled water. Our drinking water here is the best in the United States. Unless your municipality is shocking yours with chlorine due to some unknown hazard, your drinking water should be perfectly fine with no metallic taste. If you have a bad taste, it could be from your vitamins. What have your labs been like? Hows your iron? Google "metallic taste from vitamins" and see what pops up. That's what I do, and I've solved many problems that way.

I also hate the word "Tool". My DS is not a "tool". My sister, however, is a tool, but that's another topic. You don't have a window of time that after which you cannot lose weight with the DS. You cannot "break" your DS. It will always be there, malabsorbing the rest of your life. Unlike the RNY, which is a true "tool" that must be managed, because the malabsorption disappears, or the Lapband or the Sleeve as a stand alone. Those are "tools" because you have to use them correctly or they don't work. That's why the DS has the highest rate of permanent weight loss of any WLS.

Be careful what you believe from GHP. They haven't always spouted the truth, especially the surgeons there. My own surgeon still states during his Orientation meetings that the DS causes "room clearing, paint peeling" farts, and 10 BM's per day. I've yet to have this happen in my own personal experience. If I'd have believed him, I would have been scared away at that point. And if I'd have believed the first NUT I talked to at GHP, I'd have been hospitalized for severe dehydration from lactose intolerance. She told me to just keep drinking milk, and take some Lactaid pills.

Like Ronald Reagan said: "Trust, but verify".

[Melinda]

I was considered a lightweight. It took me a full year to lose 100 lbs. Then the 2nd year I lost another 30 lbs. Slow and steady wins the race, too.

[redbabe08]

[quote author=sheanie board=lightweights thread=1031 post=63419 time=1341506441
I also hate the word "Tool". My DS is not a "tool". My sister, however, is a tool, but that's another topic. [/quote]

HA!

i'm petite - 4'11 - 103lbs, i get in around 75-85g of protein a day.
can't do any kind of protein drink, so i eat roughly 8 times a day - starting with a big glass of milk. i do full fat everything & add some more occasionally ...

i eat exactly what i'm craving in the moment - don't subscribe to forbidden foods till i get to goal or any of that other nonsense .

snacking on some fresh heirloom tomatoes & basil now - i see cheesecake in my future this evening.

it's all individual - and every journey is different, as it should be.

ETA - my labs are great, much more so this time last yr when i had the lap band strangling my liver.

[Sandra C.]

Hi Guys,
This post is in dier need of updating!!!!
Dr Kemmeter made a bit larger sleeve for me because I wanted to eat out with friends, and not have them know i had surgery. I feel like its small, holds 8 oz of solids,or 16 oz shake over an hour sipping. I've been careful not to over fill it, don't want to stretch it out losing restriction.

Metallic taste, and painful dry mouth--- all gone. The typical change in taste post surgery is due to pain meds, and/or anesthesia, time resolved this. The dry mouth was solved with an elimination diet, and visit to the allergist, and a 60 stick allergy test up and down my back. The major offenders for me are: Splenda/Sucralose, eggs, tuna, shrimp, lobster, pecans, hazelnuts, mixed nuts, spinach. I'm not lactose intolerant, or latex sensitive as I thought.

D.S. life is good---- My labs are super, my energy is good, gym workouts going fine, I'm happy with my current weight, like the look and the way my clothes fit. I feel and look healthy. No one suspects I have had WLS. When I tell them about my surgery I am always promoting the D.S. for anyone they may know who may be in need of WLS. I'm sending them to Grand Rapids- GHP, Saint Mary's hospital, and Dr Kemmeter. I couldn't be happier with my results due to all their help this year. ;-)

I use bottled water to carry around town when I'm out. Usually I make my shakes and protein drinks with tap filtered water. The metallic taste is gone. Many post surgery people say they have tastes like this from the pain meds, or anesthesia. they wear off in time.

GHP & Nut--- Dr. Kemmeter and his team have been super helpful to me. Especially Christine, answering all my on line questions all this year. Dr Kemmeter has a special interest in his patients welfare pre and post surgery. Most surgeons get the job done, then you rarely see them again, not him. He has kept close tabs on his D.S'ers, making sure they are successful with weight loss and healthy. I will have to say I am proactive about my health care asking lots of questions of all my medical team members.

D.S.---- I think its the most forgiving of all the possible surgeries with individual food choices, losing weight, and maintaining. It does allow individual food journeys, as long as enough protein, fluids and vitamins are maintained daily.

Tool--- For those of you who are in the pre surgery research phase of your journey, Drs like to say the D.S. is a tool to help you reach your WL goal. Don't expect any of these surgeries to magically do the work for you. The D.S. malabsorbtion qualities do help, but there are lots of ways to make it work for you better than other surgeries. Food choices- low carb, low fruit, no sugar, high protein, lots of fluid, fiber, calcium, no processed meats, gluten free. These have been my choices to achieve my goal weight, and maintain it for the past 4 months.

Goal weight-- Pre surgery I chose a goal weight from my weight during my college days- 125. I thought I would be ecstatic if I could reach it some day. Dr Kemmeter and team never choose a goal for anyone, but they do keep track of BMI ranges. I did press them for a goal for me, their answer was any where within the normal BMI range. Once I reached "normal" they were asking me if I was ready to stop, they would help me maintain. I wanted to see what lower weights would feel and look like, since I am 5"2" in petite sizes now. Considering gaining goes along with trying to maintain, I want some leeway of at least 5+ lbs. I am at my original goal, but want to take off another 8 lbs for a safety zone. Eating anything I want has not made me gain more than 4 lbs, then it goes back down. I love my D.S. !!! ;-)