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Post by poodles on Aug 31, 2012 20:03:34 GMT -5
Short and Simple:
My labs suck. My gut goes off if I take my vitamins. I end up with IBS symptoms and take Bentyl for the pain. Also end up with "hot lava poo's" and that leads to hemmoroids. My protein is low, vitamin A is low, cholesterol is really low.
Everyplace I read on the internet says I need Flagyl to kill off thing in my gut to help with the gas and frequent poo's. My doctors nurse won't listen, because she says everyone on these boards are ignorant and don't know what they are talking about. My PCP won't write it for me, says to go to my surgeon. Surgeon's nurse is upset me me for not taking my vitamins says I need to see a gastrointerologist. No gastrointerologist wants to see me because I have the DS and says to go to my WLS. No one wants to help me.
I can buy the Flagyl online without a prescription, but don't know a reputable source.
I have changed my diet and eat meat and veggies/fruits. Hardly any carbs. Now my cholesterol is low and I got yelled at for that. I don't drink milk because it causes issues, I don't eat watermelon because it causes issues. I drink lemon juice which will cause issues if I drink too much.
I am sick and tired of issues. I take a probiotic and enzymes to try and help, but apparently it is not enough.
Anyone have any advice? I don't want "hot lava poo's" or hemmoroids, don't want horrible gas pain, but I need to take my vitamins. I just feel screwed. Would also like advice on a non whey based protein source, because I can't drink protein shakes without IBS issues.
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Post by KathyF on Aug 31, 2012 20:26:02 GMT -5
Which probiotics are you taking? Have you tried using chia seeds? Have you tried immodium? How low is your cholesterol? Mine is 95 and nobody has yelled at me yet.
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Post by poodles on Aug 31, 2012 21:26:33 GMT -5
Mine is 101. Supposedly, I could lose hair, fingernails, have heart failure, etc... The nurse was really upset with my labwork. Taking the refridgerated 30 billion kind of probiotic. I just took the max dose tonight of both kinds. The lady at Sprouts told me to start at the lowest dose for a week and then bump up, but since it is a four day weekend, I am just going for it. The other probiotic has enzymes in it to help digest dairy/stuff. So I am hoping the combo will work. Immodium just constipates me.
I have chia seeds that I mix in my lemonade sometimes. How do you use it?
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citizenk9
Junior Member
Posts: 99
Surgery Type: DS
Surgery Date: 10/13/2009
Surgeon: Dr, John Rabkin, San Francisco, CA
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Post by citizenk9 on Aug 31, 2012 21:27:34 GMT -5
I think it's just Fish Zole right? Anyway, have you tried to see if it is just one of your vitamins causing issues or tried other brands? Maybe you don't need to avoid them all. Just play around a bit.
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Post by poodles on Aug 31, 2012 21:41:53 GMT -5
I have omitted everything and added one back at a time. Iron causes gas/acid poo's. Stopped that and took just Dr. Stewarts multivitamin, it caused gas/pain, almost like it was stuck. So I smushed it and tried again with same results. Tried Bariatric Advantage, tried liquid multi's thinking it was the pills. Tried taking Vitalady's things out of the capsules (gross btw), caused gas issues.
I can take smushed Alive pills and Garden of Life RAW protein shakes with no issues.
I have tried Kombucha tea to try and help my gut. Tried RAW milk. Thought I might be lactose intolerant and cut out all dairy, but still had issues with the vitamins. I can eat chicken/avacados/tomatoes/onions/flour tortillas and Rice Noodle Pho soup with no issues at all. But I can't live on that.
I am really at my wits end. My doctors nurse says "she can't help me if I'm not going to take the vitamins as instructed". "The people on the internet don't know more than the doctor." "You need to take the vitamins no matter what, or go see a gastrointerologist." But NO gastrointerologists will help me they tell me to see Dr. Stewart. So I go around in circles... and never get better. One side doesn't want to help me because I need tohelp myself by taking the vitamins, the other side won't help me because I am a cut up weight loss surgery patient with rerouted guts.
I just need someone to tell me what to do. I haven't been able to figure it out with an elimination diet. The only thing that helps is Bentyl... the IBS medicine. And even that does not work 100 percent of the time.
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Post by bboop on Aug 31, 2012 23:00:35 GMT -5
Don't know where you live but I have a gastro that knows all about the DS, and he still see me. In fact I'm working myself up to have a colonoscopy. But I digress..you must 1) see Dr. Stewart in person; 2) find a gastro that will work with you. You must take you vitamins...I don't have any advice on what to do to figure out which ones are causing the problem...it sounds as if you have done an elimination regimine and that didn't work. You need professional help...pure and simple. Try to find another grastro. Explain what is going on...but in order to do that, you need to see your surgeon first and perhaps he has an idea what is going on.
I took iron infusions and they worked really well, in fact I don't take iron tables anymore since the infusions. I think, I'm not sure but I think calcium can be given via IV, but you will have to ask about that one.
Fish sole is the stuff you need to get online...I don't have a reliable source but somebody on here must know where to get it. Wait for a reply on that one.
You are absolutely right to be concerned. You must get this acidic poo stopped and only a gastro can help you with that. Perhaps there is something anatomically wrong in your gut...Dr. Stewart is the person that can answer that question. Tell his nurse you want to see him and don't take no for an answer. Maybe you need some pictures of your gut taken to asertain what is going on.
I know my IBS seems to have resolved itself after my second surgery (a resleeve) so I do know what you are going through. Keep the faith and go step by step to resolve this...call Dr. Stewart first then get to a good gastro...just cause one said no, not all of them will, I promise. Betty
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Post by KathyF on Aug 31, 2012 23:26:57 GMT -5
Mine is 101. Supposedly, I could lose hair, fingernails, have heart failure, etc... The nurse was really upset with my labwork. Taking the refridgerated 30 billion kind of probiotic. I just took the max dose tonight of both kinds. The lady at Sprouts told me to start at the lowest dose for a week and then bump up, but since it is a four day weekend, I am just going for it. The other probiotic has enzymes in it to help digest dairy/stuff. So I am hoping the combo will work. Immodium just constipates me. I have chia seeds that I mix in my lemonade sometimes. How do you use it? Iron infusions are an option. Especially if the oral iron upsets your system so much. What kind of bacteria are in the probiotics you are taking? There are different kinds that do different things. You may need to change what kind you are taking. I concur about seeing a different gastroenterologist if the one you are going to doesn't want to work with you. I suggested immodium because of the frequent lava poos. Have you tried a smaller dose to see if it would help without constipating? I've never used chia seeds, but have read from others who have who swear by it. Does it seem to help you at all? Instead of talking to the nurse, I would also suggest getting an appointment to Dr. Stewart himself so that you can discuss your issues with him. It shouldn't be this difficult to take your vitamins. Are there any of your supplements that you can take? I would start with those, leave off the multi vitamins for now. If you are drinking lemon water, I doubt you need to take any vitamin C. Maybe try a multi mineral (just trace minerals with no vitamins) and take your vitamins separately.
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Post by charlee on Sept 1, 2012 10:25:18 GMT -5
I deal with a lot of MD ignorance too - having trouble finding a PCP (tried several family practice docs and internists) who is willing to deal with DS needs and not be all condescending and act like I'm a clueless twit. grrrrr ANYway, I get fish zole on ebay www.ebay.com/itm/Fish-Zole-Forte-Metronidazole-500mg-60-Capsules-/160777069533?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item256f0f63ddI don't use it often, but nice to have it without going through waiting for an appt with someone who just looks at me like I've sprouted a new head and then says, "No." Do read up on the different kinds of greeblies in your probiotics - each type deals with different stuff. So many DSers swear by Primal Defense Ultra, but it didn't work for me. Sorry you're having such a shitty time (pun only mildly intended) and I hope it gets better!!
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Post by hilary1617 on Sept 1, 2012 13:33:46 GMT -5
No real advice here, other than it probably is best to get in with Dr. Stewart and search for a gastro. (Maybe even get a referral to a gastro from Dr. Stewart?) Hope you get these challenges resolved and feel better soon!
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Post by Sandra C. on Sept 1, 2012 21:52:14 GMT -5
Have you thought of going to an allergist? I had a complete allergy test for a dry painful blistered mouth, and bladder pain. My allergist had me do an elimination diet for a few weeks. My urologist suggested my issues were based on too much citric acid with my endless lemonade protein drinks. My issues are not like your issues, but foods, seasonings, additives, sweeteners, protein supplements all can have an effect on your system. Chicken breast and green beans were suggested by my allergist to clear my system for a week, then add your usual foods one at a time. Journaling your experiences with each food helps, my allergist studied my journal. His conclusion was to say there are just too many additives in my diet with all the shakes, supplements, diet products for him to determine the cause of my issues. I kept up the journaling, and eliminated each sweetener for a week, and re tried them all. Splenda was the cause of my mouth dryness, blisters and bladder pain. Its in everything. Too much citric acid also causes bladder pain for me. I need to pay attention to new episodes of pain, and cut back when needed. Hope you can find a solution to your issues. I believe no "one "Dr can figure it all out. D.S.ers are way to complicated for most Dr's. ;-)
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Post by smileyjamie on Sept 1, 2012 22:01:54 GMT -5
((((Hugs))))) coming here and getting advice is definately a great place to start. I did not know about the difference in probiotics. I just learned something new!!!!!!
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Post by newyorkbitch on Sept 2, 2012 1:52:55 GMT -5
Are you taking a PPI?
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Post by patxyz on Sept 2, 2012 12:16:13 GMT -5
This was the first thing I thought of too. Hot lava poo for me is a result of too much acid. When I bumped up my Prevacid from once a day to twice a day is went away completely.
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Post by poodles on Sept 2, 2012 14:17:29 GMT -5
I am not on an antiacid at all. I have some, so I will take those today and see if it helps.
I went out to eat twice yesterday and stayed up half the night praying for death. This is the second time I have had cramps so bad I wanted to die after I ate a piece of pizza. So, my promise to God is to never eat pizza again. Went to the Chinese Buffet for lunch and ate my usual egg foo yung, beef out of the beef and broccoli, a few wontons in soup, and some shrimp. My gut was mildly upset after that, but nothing like after I ate that pizza.
Made my veggie soup today: Chicken, squash, zucchini, cauliflour, tomatoes, chicken broth and so far so good. Broccoli and Cauliflour do not give me as much gas as white carbs do. But, I stay away from those in general.
Purchased a new brand of probiotics + enzymes, some digestive advantage for IBS, and Primal Defense. Will look online for the Fish Zole and get some of those too.
Dr Stewart has a gastro that he recommends, two hours away from me, but he has a three week waiting time for his first available appointment. Guess I will get on the list and suffer until then.
My diet is basically meat cheese eggs, and organic fruits and veggies from my co-op. I can tolerate Quinoa, a little brown rice (not much), and rice noodles (PHO).
I just don't get it. Something will work one day, and not the other. Feel like I am walking thru a mine field when I try to decide what to eat/drink.
Thank you for all the help.
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Post by petham on Sept 2, 2012 17:31:07 GMT -5
I deal with a lot of MD ignorance too - having trouble finding a PCP (tried several family practice docs and internists) who is willing to deal with DS needs and not be all condescending and act like I'm a clueless twit. grrrrr ANYway, I get fish zole on ebay www.ebay.com/itm/Fish-Zole-Forte-Metronidazole-500mg-60-Capsules-/160777069533?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item256f0f63ddI don't use it often, but nice to have it without going through waiting for an appt with someone who just looks at me like I've sprouted a new head and then says, "No." Do read up on the different kinds of greeblies in your probiotics - each type deals with different stuff. So many DSers swear by Primal Defense Ultra, but it didn't work for me. Sorry you're having such a shitty time (pun only mildly intended) and I hope it gets better!! Wait, what?? What's Fish zole for, I ggogled it it's for aquariums. Can someone explain ?
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Post by Gail R on Sept 2, 2012 18:40:01 GMT -5
Petham, It is the same as the human medicine, Metronidazole. I buy it when I travel out of the country where it is available without prescription. But I must say that I am saving it for emergency use only. It is not to be taken lightly. Poodles, I am surprised that you can tolerate Pho. It is a notorious DS no no. I love it but had to give it up and I tolerate most everything. Wish I had more advice for you. Good luck in getting this sorted out. You have been given some seemingly good ideas.
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Post by petham on Sept 2, 2012 20:42:45 GMT -5
Thanks for the info. I try to stay away from antibiotics as much as I can.
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Post by poodles on Sept 2, 2012 22:06:54 GMT -5
I love Pho. It is my soup of choice. I even get the instant packets for emergency food at work. I can not tolerate Ramen very well at all. When I get the "real stuff" from my local Pho shop, I don't put alot of the noodles in. They are just filler food to me. I like the mung bean sprouts, meat, cilantro, onions, etc more than the noodles. When I get sick, I get the chicken Pho and only drink the broth. Something about the ginger makes my tummy feel better. Wonder if I can tolerate it because I don't use a ton of the noodles?
Now regarding the Fish Zole. It seems quite creepy to take fish antibiotic, but if it is the same as Flagyl I will do it, since both my doctors are not doing what I need them to, and my insurance has started over and I now have a 1200.00 deductible to meet. That 40.00 bottle of fish medicine looks pretty good right now.
From the link it looks like I need 500 mg, but don't know how many to take or for how long.
If you were to get it from a doctor, what would a typical prescription look like? I know we are not medical doctors here, but if anyone has experience would love to know what you did. May just start a new thread and see if there are examples out there too...
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Deleted
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Posts: 0
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Post by Deleted on Sept 3, 2012 14:59:27 GMT -5
When I reach the saturation point where nothing sits well ... I start drinking lots of water, plain meats and veggies. That's about it. It helps me to regroup and get back on track. If I'm not feeling well and foods aren't sitting well, pizza is top of my list of things to avoid and things with noodles are close behind it. My last Flagyl prescription (which was 10 days I believe) was 2 x 500mg tablets per day. It was for metronidazole. Here is a good thread from Diana which talks about Flagyl: weightlosssurgery.proboards.com/index.cgi?action=display&board=talk&thread=2288&page=1
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Post by mark540 on Sept 3, 2012 20:45:24 GMT -5
I find the low cholesterol comment interesting, mine usually runs in the neighborhood of 30. My dads is 46 at his last blood test. Neither of us has ever had a comment of concern from any of our physicians. Sorry to hear you are dealing with stubborn mules.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Sept 3, 2012 20:55:24 GMT -5
I am not on an antiacid at all. I have some, so I will take those today and see if it helps. I went out to eat twice yesterday and stayed up half the night praying for death. This is the second time I have had cramps so bad I wanted to die after I ate a piece of pizza. So, my promise to God is to never eat pizza again. Went to the Chinese Buffet for lunch and ate my usual egg foo yung, beef out of the beef and broccoli, a few wontons in soup, and some shrimp. My gut was mildly upset after that, but nothing like after I ate that pizza. Made my veggie soup today: Chicken, squash, zucchini, cauliflour, tomatoes, chicken broth and so far so good. Broccoli and Cauliflour do not give me as much gas as white carbs do. But, I stay away from those in general. Purchased a new brand of probiotics + enzymes, some digestive advantage for IBS, and Primal Defense. Will look online for the Fish Zole and get some of those too. Dr Stewart has a gastro that he recommends, two hours away from me, but he has a three week waiting time for his first available appointment. Guess I will get on the list and suffer until then. My diet is basically meat cheese eggs, and organic fruits and veggies from my co-op. I can tolerate Quinoa, a little brown rice (not much), and rice noodles (PHO). I just don't get it. Something will work one day, and not the other. Feel like I am walking thru a mine field when I try to decide what to eat/drink. Thank you for all the help. If you have not yet been evaluated by a gastroenterologist and gotten treatment for acid problems, those are two things that MUST happen. You need to stop self diagnosing and self medicating.
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Post by poodles on Sept 3, 2012 22:13:16 GMT -5
I appreciate the advice. Know you all are trying to help. I am just so frustrated at this point I am ready to totally give up and suffer. Seems to be my lot in life. (pity party here). If it's not kidney stones, or IBS, or back pain, its bloated guts and hemmoroids.
I have self medicated for the acid reflux. Will see if it works. I bought the stuff that you have to take twice a day, because I know time released stuff does not work for us.
Sure wishing more doctors would know more about us. They do look at me like I have a third head when I say I have the DS. Had an ER doctor say "Isn't that a video game?". That made me feel really comfortable.
But, anyway. I have had a rough few hours. Tired and Hungry and afraid to eat. No fun for me at all.
Thanks again for the advice.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Sept 3, 2012 22:23:56 GMT -5
***hugs**** Being in constant gut distress is a miserable thing. Please, please, get to a gastroenterologist. If you explain the DS to them, they are far more likely than many if not most other specialists to GET IT almost immediately. I memorized a fancy-pants description of the DS some years ago, can't remember where I read it: Subtotal vertical gastrectomy, intestinal bypass consisting of duodeno-ileostomy and ileo-ileostomy with a (in my case) 75 cm common channel. I also tell them that approximately 60% of my small intestine is bypassed for food. This spiel seems to work very well to explain to most docs what was done. (ATTN MEDICAL PEEPS: If I have this screwed up, please correct me so I can get it right .)
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Post by Leonie on Sept 4, 2012 1:22:05 GMT -5
Poodles, How do whey protein isolate shakes go down for you? If it works for an early post op?... At least you will be sure you are getting in the protein, and perhaps a day without solid, irritating food will be good. Then add the next safest food you know, like chicken or egg.
Skip the coffee, sweetners, spices EVERYTHING. Then add the vitamins bit by bit, starting with the ones you are pretty sure will not affect you.
My thinking is that perhaps there is something in your diet that is triggering this mess.
I wish I had an answer for you. I guess what I really want to tell you, is that I am thinking of you, and praying for you. Get all the help you can.
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Post by poodles on Sept 4, 2012 16:31:11 GMT -5
I have an appointment with Stewart on Thursday. Hopefully, he will help and not keep giving me the run around.
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Post by happycatbert on Sept 10, 2012 14:32:09 GMT -5
Late to this thread but I will throw in one thing that my surgeon told me years ago when I had fire ass - and it seems ridiculous, but it worked. FIBER. There are chewables that don't taste bad at all and honestly it worked for me.
Good luck.
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Post by poodles on Sept 10, 2012 20:29:03 GMT -5
You know it is a funny thing about the fiber. When I went to the ER with stabbing pain, they saw a kidney stone but also a HUGE amount of stuff in there. They told me to take Colase, magnesium citrate, and get cleaned out a bit. The kidney stone has passed now, and as of last Xray I am clear.
My DR did prescribe the flagyl and Previcid and I have been taking it since Thursday and feel better.
I have cut out most all carbs too... even the low carb tortillas I'm so addicted to.
Sure wish I knew what my gut finds acceptable.
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Post by luckylibrarian on Sept 30, 2012 20:36:07 GMT -5
How are you feeling, Poodles?
ETA: I just read the other thread. I am so glad you are feeling better.
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